#119 Moore's Law is not Dead!

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on Tue Jan 18 2022 16:00:00 GMT-0800 (Pacific Standard Time)

with Darren W Pulsipher, Jason Dunn-Potter,

In this episode, Darren talks with Jason Dunn-Potter, solution architect for the public sector at Intel, about Moore’s law and how it continues to drive innovations across the public sector.


#mooreslaw #technology #innovation #leadership #process #compute

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Jason has been with Intel for a year, and during that time, he has seen impressive technological advancements. They discuss how technology is constantly changing and improving and that Moore’s Law applies not just to the compute evolution but to the entire technology evolution. They also mention how technological advancements can be seen in everyday items such as car back up and smartphone cameras. Jason believes that Moore’s Law is still in effect and that the improvements will continue even faster in the next few years. Jason surmised that Moore’s law would continue due to critical factors driving innovation: technological advances, competition, and customer demand.

Technological advances

Technological advances have had a significant effect on Moore’s law. However, not all technological advances are straightforward and apply directly to silicon manufacturing techniques or architectures. For example, chemical engineering, material science, and optics advancements are essential in silicon manufacturing. Additionally, advances in HVAC systems and IoT sensors can substantially impact Silicon manufacturing processes. Agile organizations that can leverage technological advancements quickly drive Moore’s law beyond what is possible with today’s perspective.


As organizations continue to innovate and adopt new technologies, they create healthy competition in the ecosystem, “raising all the boats in the harbor.” Jason provides a great example of the space race in the 1960s compared to the downturn of the space industry in the 1980s and 90s. At the beginning of 1960, The United States still hadn’t effectively launched a rocket into outer space, while the Soviet Union was years ahead of The United states. Within nine years, the competition between the Soviets and the Americans drove technological change substantial enough to put men on the moon for the first time. By the end of the 1980s, the Soviet Union fell, and the competition for the space race disintegrated. Without competition, space technology became stagnant, and the rising costs of the technology limited additional research and innovation in this space. Not until the late 2010s and early 2020s did we see increased competition drive innovation in the space industry again.

The same is true for the microelectronics industry, where the competition stagnated for decades. Innovation continued but at a slower pace. as competition increased in silicon manufacturing best practices, CPU architectures, and compute acceleration technologies, organizations began to compete feverishly, improving performance, decreasing the power, and increasing the density of microelectronics dramatically. Now silicon manufacturers are talking about transistors at the angstrom size, which a decade ago was considered impossible.

Customer Demand

The last critical factor driving Moore’s law is customer demand. When innovation is introduced into the marketplace, consumers quickly find new ways to leverage the technology in new and unusual ways. As these new use cases emerge, organizations quickly innovate to create new technologies to support the new use cases identified by their customers.


Jason concludes the podcast with the prediction that Moore’s law will continue to evolve even as we run out of elements in the periodic table. As technologists, we must keep an open mind and reach beyond the boundaries currently holding us back from breakthrough innovation and technology.

Podcast Transcript


Hello, this is Darren

Pulsipher, chief solution,architect of public sector at Intel.

And welcome to Embracing

Digital Transformation,where we investigate effective change,leveragingpeople process and technology.

On today's episode of Moore's

Law is Not Dead.

With Jason Dunn-Potter

Solution Architect for the public sectorto no.

Jason,welcome to the show. Thanks, Darren.

It's always a pleasure.

Well,this is your second time or third time?

Second time.

Second time on the show.

Jason is a colleague of mine joined us.

It's been a year now.

You I just saw you just had your yearanniversary at Intel.

I did.

I'm super excited about making it the yearby the way.

Well, you know, if you make it a year,then you might as well stay for sevento get that sabbatical.

That's coming. Up.

That's what we talk about.

So todaywe want to talk about Moore's Law.

There's a lot of conversationout there in the industrythat, hey, Moore's Law is dead.

We can't get any more out of Moore's Law.

Let's talk a little bit.

Let's dive right into that.

Sure. Let's talk about it.

So I will tell youand I've only been here a year,but what I've seen in the last year,it's just been impressiveand we've been a busy year.

I mean, you think about all the thingsthat are going on,you know, I mean, obviously the launchthis week is a big dealand everybody wants to talk about that.

But I want to talk about the revolutionthat got us to thatand all of the work that went into this.

You know, a long time ago,a great leader told me iron sharpens iron.


And I didn't know what that meant.

I had to look it up by Watson first.

And he said, listen,it's all about if you surround yourselfwith great people, you become better.


And when your greatyou make everybody else look better.

And at the end of the day, when you lookat what Gordon Moore and the Giants,the team behind him did,you can see how far we've come.

And it's a short matter everyone every dayunderstands technology's change.

Just look at, you know, your car's backupcamera in the last five years, right?

Every time I get into a new car, I lookat, you know, we rent cars all the time.

I travel.

Every time I get in a brand new car,

I realize it's even better than before.

Sharper image, brighter colors,all the technology advancementsand the little things.


Think about how big you know, how much,how much better your camera zoomis on your smartphone.

You know, we are aggressively moving out.

And every

I would say Moore's Law applies to a lotmore than just the compute evolution.

I think it is the entire technologyevolution is following.

So you still think that everyto every two years everything'sdoubling in speed or performanceor whatever the case may be?

You still believe it?

I do.

And I will tell you,looking at our roadmap for 24 and 25,

I believe it's going to be even faster.

And it's an average. Right.

But at the end of the day.

Well, yeah.

I mean, we've seen this in our roadmapsbefore, right?

We've had our size of transistorsstall for a little bit,and then all of a suddensome new technology comes up and nowwe're three timesfour times smaller than the previous one.

So, yeah. And it all comes downto competition, right?

Competition makes you better.

It's no different watching the Olympiansgo out every year.

You know what?

Everybody watches the Olympics, right?

Because national pride,but also to watch people at the topof their game perform things that,you know, other people just dream of.

And I feel the same way in Intelwhen I see the engineering talking aboutwe set a lot of meetingsand I will tell yousome of those meetings, I am not thesmartest guy in the room by a long shot.

But when we talk to those folksthat you can tell that have been writing

FPGA code and building the actual buildingblocks of the future, that competition,that that that dedication to effortand improvement is real.

And the other thing to think aboutthat is it's not just, you know,it's all the research and development thatbuilds on everyone else's effort, right?

It's it's no differentthan like building a car. Right?

If you look at ayou know, you look at a car from 1980,you look at a car from this year,significant safetyimprovements, significant technologyimprovements, just holistically,a much better vehicle, lighter, bettergas mileage, all of those thingsbased on the capability,titanium safety rods,like all of that is now.

I mean, we can buy a bicycle now, right?

I mean, it is it is significant.

Like anybody can buy that and a bicycleand a bicycle shop now in town. So.

So do you do you feel that sometimeswithout the competitionthat technology lags?

So I.

I do. I do. I mean, what would you say?

So my thought process is simple.

Like at the end of the day,if you're don't have anybody directlycompeting with you,then you have no reason to try toyou have no reason to enhance your productline.


If you're the only game in town,then you're the only game in town.

There's no there's no driver, Right.

Business is business. Right?

At the end of the day,making money is important for companies,but here's the thing, right?

I'm not going to invest moneyin research and developmentand advancementand capability and enhancement.

If I'm making margin every quarter.

Right. Forever.

There's no reason there.

Justification to spend the research, spendthe money and the energy to get better.


But, you know, when you said thatthe first thing that part of my mindwas the 1960s.



That the moonshot we were in competition.


With with the Soviet Union,the United Stateswas in competition with the Soviet Unionto get man on the moon.

And we as the United States,were far behind.

Absolutely. And then we weren't right.

And then we werewhen JFK made that first speech.

So you got to remember, nowwe standing on an empty platform.

There's nothing behind it.

There's no rocket.

There's no engineering,there's no shuttle, there's no nothing.


He is standing on a platformgiving a speech about what could be rightand then right.

And we didn't even launch our first rocketfor four years after that.


Like, if you look at the history of that,that process, the crawl, walk, run,as we like to call it. Right.

When you go from just got there.

There was there was crawling,but there was no walking.

Right here for us to run it.

And now we have rocketsthat return on their ownand land on a moving ship at sea.

I mean well and that.

Yeah,but, but our space, we kind of stalledbecause there was no more competition.

There was no more competition.

And that leads back to the point, right?

If you don't have anybody driving youfor success and you don't have anybodyyou know what they say,you know, risk it for the biscuit.

If you're not hungry. Right.

You're not going to be,you know, challenged.

And if you're not challenged,you're not improving.

And it's no differentthan people who train for marathons.


People who go out and excelin some capability or skill.

I will tell you that nothing makesyou better or put out more

Christmas decorations than your neighborputting up Christmas.

That's right.

Oh, no,that's not true in your life. Right.

You like? Well,everybody did that. That was great.

And then the next person got an inflatableand now everybodygot an inflatable, right?

And then somebody had those bigstick there and then it goes from there.

So I think.

All right. So she'll a

I have a question around that.

Do you think because you're new to Intelso you can have a perspective outside?

I've been in Intel too long now.

I've been here 12, 13 years.

Coming up, Do you think that maybe Intelgot complacent,that we didn't have competition,real competition for some timeand now we doand see that's changing things?

You know what?

Honestly, I think there'sthere's some truth in that.

I think that we were the biggestwe were the biggest game in town.


Everybody knows

I can't walk into a room of anywhereand someone doesn'twhen I say I work at Inteland they like, Oh,

I know what that is, right?

They may not know everything about whatthat is,but they have a name, face recognition.

I mean, there's there's a couple keycompanies in the world that if you say,

I work at wherever, if you remember, like,oh, I know what that is, right?

Intel is that and I will tell you,if I asked them to name five other chipcompanies,they will not be able to tell you that.


Even todaythey may be able to name one or two maybe.

But then, by and large, most of the folksworking in like public high schooldo not you know, like teachers.

I mean,we do a lot of community service folks,teachers, firefighters, other folks.

They may not be able to name three.

Let's do that, to be fair. Right.

And and so there's value in that,having a name that everybody recognizes.

But you got to earn that reputation.

And here's the other thing.

Reputation is only as goodas your last product, right?

So, you know, there's a lot of companies,

Sears, Kmart and others.

You know, wetalk about some of these old Woolworth'sand some of these other old companiesthat are doing so hard.

And today you can tellthey were the king of king of things.

I mean, Sears was one of the first onesto ever do the Sears catalog.

I mean.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Which nicely they did online.

They were online, right?

They were the their versionbefore online seller.

And you know what?

They had that competitive edgefor decades, like decades and decades.

And now it's hard to find one.

And so you got to always beyou can never be.

And I hate to

I hate to dwell on these companiesbecause there weresome really hardworking folksthat worked in all of these places.

Oh, and as.

Readers have, you cannot become complacentin your space.

If you do, you will fall to Blockbuster.

You will fall for the other nonevolving iterations of things.

You know, Fujitsufell on in the analog film business,you know, Polaroidin the original print of Kodak.

Right when we were kids,there was photo booths on every corner.

There were 24 hour turnaround.

You got duplicates and youget the negatives and all of that, right?

None of that exists today.

And it's not thatthe technology was going to stay the same.

It's not that the factthat it was going to revolutionize.

Do you want to keep being that namein the revolutionary space where you were,you're moving out.

You're you're being that edge provider,by the way.

Think about it.

Think about how big Blockbusterwas compared to how big Netflixwas for 20 minutes.


Largest retailer in the world, right?

I mean, honestly,all over the country for for Blockbuster.

And that place was a startupwith 20 people.


They kind of gobbledthem for it for 20 bucks.

But they said, no, we'regoing to pass because we don't feel likethat's a good business model for us.

And Blockbuster, everyone knew the name.

Everyone right? Yeah, yeah.


And even my kids know what Blockbuster isonly because they watched

Stranger Things.

And during your phaseof the one of those Marvel movies.

Yeah, one of the Marvel movies. Yeah.

They're just today the movie. Know.

So you didn't have to. Well, of. Course.

Yeah, right.


Yeah. So. So what prevents,what preventsa large companies from falling falling.

So I mean, I.

Think having a business strategythat ever evolves,you always have to be looking atwhat am I doing nowand how do I get to the next plateau,right?

Especially in a tech companyor an industry and it's service relatedwhere you're providing to the company,to the public.

Right. Let's take

I mean, look at look at education, right?

Education was books in librariesfor centuries, booksin libraries, books in libraries.


Well, you go into a library today andit doesn't have computers and terminals.

It's not a library you'd recognize, right?

Not today.

And so they're already makingthat evolutionary jump to say,how do I provide educationand information exchange?

Anybody can go home and Google something.

But how are for writing content and how.

Is it different in a library? Yeah, right.

How is it different libraryand how am I developing thosethose those programsso that people will want to come to them?

And so, yeah, you know,

I have a lot of experience in that.

That's, you. Know,another one that just popped to my mind.

And it's a companythat that owns the marketand had a huge competitorand that's a Walmart.


Walmart's biggest competitors, Apple.

Amazon by far.

Right, Right. By far.

But guess what?

Walmart is kick in therebut in certain things.

And they pivotedand they pivoted in such a wonderful waythat my kids are that my kids have kids.


They right they drive upand the groceries are put in their trunkand they drive away.



Because, you know,go to the store and get it right now.

And it's that that right now.

And, you know, I'm a I want to handlehold it in my hand.

I want to look at the product.

I want to knowthat I'm getting what I want it right.

Well, and then also, it's funny becausebecause my daughter, who's got kids,she doesn't want to take the kidsin the store,who wants to take a one year old,not a four year old and a six yearold around Walmart,when it's snowing outside, no one.

Will look at it.

Look at Albertsons, Safeway, Randallsand H-E-B down here in South Texas.

They all have drive up curbside.

Now you can order all your shoes.

You pull up,they throw in the back of the car.

Let me tell you,if you've got a physical disability,if you've got to ride a little crash cartaround the store, nothing'seasier than pulling upand getting those groceries.hand-Deliver it right in and out.

You made your selection.

You had plenty of time.

You can reorder the same things.

It's not just a little better.

It's a whole lot better for some people.

Now I am soand there's I want to walk the store,but not everybody wants to do that.

Yeah, no, but there's still somethinginteresting about that. It'sbecause Walmart bought yet they could havejust moved completely retail.

But they understood one thing.

People still want a sense of community.

They still want to know

When I drive to Walmartand the drive thru where the pull up,

I recognize the shopper that bought mythat got my stuff for meand I can say thank you.

They still want some connectionto their community.

It's also. Considered community.

It's awesome and there's a lot of goodwillthat comes out of that. Right?

So the answer original question,

I think the big thing is alwaysbe looking to be more agilebecause that is the only wayto stay competitive.

And if you're not always asking,you should wake up every morning.

You're a senior leader in a companyjust like ours.

You should be asking,okay, what's next? Right?

It's never like,

Oh, we're good, we're never good.

We are never, ever going to be great.

Like one product awayfrom being replaced by somebody else.

And there are a lot of other companiesin the same trade spacethat don't exist anymore for the exactreason they did not evolve fast enough.

They did not pivot to the next opportunitylike it's a thing.

So let's talk a little bit aboutdo you feel that that competitionthat we just talked aboutand the ability to innovate and be agile,is that what's really driving

Moore's Lawor is it just that we're getting smarter?

You know what?

I think it's

I think it's definitely the competitionbecause here's the thing, right?

It's not what nobody no one personwas the Gordon Moore of today.

Right? We are a team.

We're like I said, I am sharpens iron.

We have a plethora of engineering assetsand people dedicated to this tradeand they are working every dayto make it a little bit betterand be more efficient.

You need a comprehensive team.

No one person is the answer. I look at.

I mean, look at the CEO.

He's not the only onethat was on the chip design.

It was a team of folks, right.

And then they have one captains ship.

The whole crew makes that happenand everybody appreciates that.

And I will tellyou. So are you saying thatthe systems are too complex todayfor it to all fit into one person's head?

So I don't know that that's true,because I think that there'ssome evolution like advancements.

Somebody came up with the idea and thena team went to work to build that idea.

Oh, gotcha.

So I'm kind of like Elon.

Elon Musk, Let's talk about it.

Right, right, right.

Love him, hate him,doesn't matter. And respect.

He has moved, right?

He has moved industriesbecause he went in that directionand he got people to follow him.

So he is going to the space industry.

Boring company Nuro.

Now, Neuralinknot just a thing, all kinds of things.

But the other thing to keep in mindis that those people existwhere they're outside the paradigm shift,where they say, Why not, right?

Don't tell me you can't do it.

Tell me why we can't do it,and then show mehow we're going to get over that,because we can't.


Somebody said,

Oh, we've never done that before.

Great, let's go do that anyway.

And this is the same thing.

This is no different than the first peoplethat invention parachute seatbelts.

You're that person.

By the way.

Let's talk aboutthe parachute thing. Sure.


Because this because we feel this waysometimes we do.

All right.

If you and I were inventing the parachute,who would use it first, Right?

So I will tell you right now,somebody that you trust,someone who's got a lot of risk,the risk averse, Right.

They just jump in there. Right.

And then also, you know, do I need it?


What what drove that innovation? Right.

And what drove innovation wasthe military needed a new solution.

And now we have Hobie Parachutesthat go out on weekends.

And I mean, they're all electricwhere you can jump out.

I've got a friendthat's that's like three or 4000 jumpsthen on his like

I mean, he is a jump junkie and I'm sorry.

That to me is crazy.

Why would you jump out of a perfectly goodflying machine?

I will tell you that there'slots of thrill seekers there.

And there is there's ait's the best 2 minutes in sports, right?

I know. That's all right.

So, Jason, I have I have to ask youa personal question then,because you you're retired Army man.

So did you have to jump out of it? Nope.


I was an Air Force guy with a helicopterand saw a guy.

I never got a chanceto go to airborne school and I never over.

So, you know, I.

Was too old to go and everything hurts.

That athlete on our team definitely went.

And I believe Joe Hollander also went.

I think he did I think I'm pretty.

Sure they both win.

It's very common for them to you knowa lot of lot of folks go it's not a

I'm not a small community of folkslike I would say probably,

I don't know, anywherebetween 15 to 15 to 20% ofthe military has gone through some kindof training with that nature.

And itmay be a little silly, but it's it'sdefinitely more than a few.


So let's talk a little bit about thisbeforehand.

We talked a little bitabout this competition thing.

There's all sorts of competitions.

We talked a little bit about the Olympics.

There's also war.

That's a form of competition, right? Sure.

All these things dry ofreally rapid growth in technologyis some for efforts like for war.

You're creating technology to defendand to destroy.

Sure. Basically. Right.

But there's some spin out of that as wellbecause it advances it.

It raises all boats.

I want to

I want to shave that a little bitbecause it's it's more than that.

It's okay.

So a lot of folks don't realize that thethe policy and politicsthat go into war development,let's say technology development, it'snot just to win decisively,it's to limit your opponent's abilityto cause significant impact.


It's also the ability to provideenhanced medical triage and careso you can get people back on their feetfaster.

It's also all of the thingsto do logistics and resourcing tothe edge, because everybody knowsthat wars are won on their,you know, on logistics.

And so it's not just we're not justtalking about smart munitions.

We're talking about the entire holisticlook at when you look at the DODas a whole, right.

How they do business,they find all kinds of thingsthat they care significantly aboutand whether it's betterfirst aid, bandages that get,you know, troops back in the fightinstantaneously.

We have smart bandagesthat have chemicals in them.

So when they're exposed to blood, itrelease the chemical.

So they put the bandage on, wrap around.

And that immediately causesa coagulation of the wound.

Right. Saving lives and limbs.

And everybody carriedit wasn't like specialtroops had them everyone out, everyone

So people.


Well and that feeds into that feedsinto the public, obviously.


And now paramedics are even betterbecause of it. And. Right.

And we've got all of this technologyadvanced that comes out of these tools.

And so when we talk about,hey, talk about war as a concept,because it's it's so much broader,the discussion is some of thatis just winning the information campaignso that people know we're winning.


Because if you think you're going to lose,you're going to lose, right?

That's how.

Yeah, yeah, that's true. It's like boxing.

If you go in there and you're pretty surethe first three rounds went terrible,the next nine are going to be brutal.


And you negative to that -12 rounds,you're out at four.

Right. It's hardhow much you have in the game, but.

But it's everything.

It's all the technology that goes into it.

It's all of the capability enhancement.

But let's apply that to business modeling.

It's the same exact thingmodel standpoint.

It's how do I maintain my relevancy,how do I maintain my competitive edge?

How do I make surethat we havethe best product on the market,and how do I takeadvantage of the technology hurdlesthat are coming up and say, hey, you know,no different than when we we've all seentechnological advancements.

We went from,you know, cell phones to smartphones.

We went from, you know,old connectorsfor computers to USB everything, right?

Universal, simple, hot swappable.

I didn't have to shut down the machineto plug in a device anymore.

Right. Right.

Like all those little thingsaren't little. There.

We major milestonesand advancements in technologyand those are the things that continueto push youto the edge of the capabilitywhere you are the forefront.

This is where people know your name right?

We have a great commercial.

You've never seen it.

It's theour rock stars are like your rock stars.

It's fantastic about the creatorof the USB fantastic video.

And if you don't know anything about it,all it says onthe bottom is creator of the USB, right?

That's it. You don't, you don't need it.

The understanding of how he got there,you don't even understand him.

The team and the energy and the hoursof the years that it took to get there.

All you know is it revolutionizedthe way you do machine work.

And today every person plugs in theirphone to everything and the ability right.

And we are continuing to add

Thunderbolt four.


Took a usb-c and said, hey, how do I getmore out of that same connector?


Just one more example of of evolutionor change.

And it's not a thing.

It's everything.

You have to be agile in every area,especially when you talk about, you know,you can havethe best technology in the world,but if you don't have a logisticsfabrication facilitythat can keep up with demand,if you don't have the supply and logisticschannels worked out.

So there's a lot of other advancements.

It's not just technology advancements,it's being agile, being smarterthan your competitionon how to get the right resourcesto the right place at the right time,you know,cut down on the work in place, right.

Workingup, work in progress, the whip right.

Shorten the whip cycle so that you can getmore to the field faster.

At the end of the day,that's the stuff that drivesinnovative change of businesses.

No different than automating logisticssystems, RPA screenscrapers that pull from analog systemsthat bring the digital systemsand advances there.

Just any one of those thingscould be the change that you need.

I mean, let's think about like FedEx,right?

FedEx went toe to toewith the Postal Service for 20 minutesand they were like, look,we can get you therefaster, better, smarter

UPS has been around forever, right?

For as long as I can remember.

And then I'll send FedEx.

It's like, Yeah,but I can do that by planeand I can clock that package to your door.

And then pretty soon there's a great memeabout all these different likeand the post office sendsyou a notification.

It's probably on its way right?

And then real close, UBS sendsyou a note saying, Hey, how far is that?

How many days out? FedEx says, Hey,

I left it on your doorstep.

Here's a photo.

You know what I mean? So it's like thisand they're all.

So in.

Continuing its reasons that.

Yeah, it's raising everything.

So this competition's great.

Let's talk a little bit about

Intel, because Intel we competereally interestingly.


We compete on the process nodes,which means thethe actual building in the siliconand we also competeon the architecture side, which iswhat am I putting on that silicon? So.

Right. Yeah.

I think the biggest surprisefor me was Discoverhow much work we put into software.

So something like,

I don't know, 15 to 20000 softwaredevelopers at any given moment,making the software side of the hardwaremore efficientbetween that, between the OS layerand the hardware layerso that you get the best API maximizationbecause at the end of the day,if the workload runs faster than you thinkthe CPU is running faster,you can't make a corollarythat the software is enablingthe hardware to run faster.

And that is one example of thatlittle tweakwhere people don't realizewhen I say that people are like,

We had no idea

Intel's got that many software developers.

I say, Yeah, do think about it.

We're maximizing that one APIand all of the effort that's going intoall of that work is optimizingthose workloads to get the absolutelike, like alike a fine tuned sports car, right.

If you know, just havingthe engine is not good enough,you got to get in there, tunethat thing and make it home.

And if you can have a jump and.

Then you also have to have somethingto drive. It.

Right. And all. Right.

So someone once said the software is thesoul of the is the soul of the machine.

I don't know.

I want to go in there.

I know you're on.

I thought that was interesting, right?

Because, hey, if there's no software,then our hardware doesn't do anything.

No, that's true.

That's only true, right? It's it.

And so that's the other thingyou got to think about is Intelcan't be just known as the one companythat makes one product.

That's not true. It'snot even kind of true.

Everything can be autonomous carsto light and camera technologiesand everything else.

FPGA and radar advancements.

They do a ton of things.

People have no idea.

We're doing all over the placeand that is that's a misnomer.

And that's the other problem,that that's the one problem with success,

I will tell you is everybody knows youfor what they know you for.

They don't necessarily know youfor everything that you do, Right.

Yeah, there's a great, great joke about,you know,you know, you build this walland you do all these things,but you make one big mistake,and that's all everyone will ever know.

That's all anyone reminds you.

Doesn't matter. All the good workthat you do all over the place.

That's the other thingin the ethics, though.

But I'm really excited about Intelis all the ethical work that they're doingand all of the work of putting intocommunity service and outreach programsand all the stuff that the CEO is doingwith community colleges to help push A.I.to the edge with open vinoand all of that, you know, giving it away.

Like you can go to YouTube rightnow, pull down and open vino and watch,you know, 20, 30 videos on how to usecomputer vision.

Open vino and one API.

Yeah, that's that's one thinga lot of people understand.

A lot of the softwarethat we develop is for the community.



Well,and it's not completely altruistic now.

But it's going to saythere's a kickback. That right.

The kickback is a sourcedevelopment pipelinewhere I got a junior high school studentnow playing with a I in seventh grade.


That is a huge story.

By the time they turn 25, right?

Yeah, absolutely.

All right.

Let's talk about some ofthe new innovations that we're seeingbecause we talked earlierabout the process.

No, we're we're we're shippingfive nanometers, which is super small.

Super small.


And and I mentioned this in Michigan,the coronavirus is 72nanometers in diameter.

We're shipping transistorstoday at five nanometersand in two years at 18 angstroms,which is 1.8 nanometers.

That's really, really small.

Just the factthat we're measuring and angstromsshould be a world renowned high five.

For my technology.

It really is.

What tells me Moore's Law is never donelike that has never been more true todaythan it's been in its entire existence.

Well, I don't know.

When we start move, Can we go subatomic?

I don't think we can.

I don't know how far.

Well, here's the thing, right?

We never thoughtwe'd get past the sound barrier.

And now you do it every day.

Right? Yeah. We never got that.

I will tell you, if you tryand you've ever interviewed a grandparentfrom the thirties and fortiesabout the advancement of the technology,remember?

Now, we didn't go past supersonicuntil like 1945, right?

And so they grew up they're those cropduster engine jets, you know, thethe biplanes of their time,the P-51 Mustang.

It was like the hottest thingbecause it was thefastest thing in the airuntil it wasn't right.


And nobody realized that first jet engineon the side of a of a vehicle.

All of a sudden, we were traveling past.

I mean, if you've ever been to an airshowand I highly recommend them,if you ever watch the Air Force

Thunderbirds or the Navy Blue Angelsand they come by and all of a suddenthey fly right over the crowdand like two, three, 4 seconds later,that sonic boom follows behind them.

That is an experienceyou will never forget.

And that's isone example of they never thought we coulduntil we did.

And now it's how. We did.

And how we did it.

And I will tell you, if you ask somebodyand say, hey, do you think we'll ever getto angstrom measurement?

And they're like,

I don't even know what that is.


And now it's about to be commonterminology in our in our industry.

That has got to be something to doa high five about in the driveway now.

No, you're absolutely right.

Now there's there's some other interestingtechnologies, not just in the size.


But also in the way that we can developnew architecturesthrough our chiplet technologywhere we can.

It's almost it'salmost like we're providing openan open door to say, come bring your bestand join it with ourso that we can make everything better.

So I would tell you for the audiencefor sure, if they don't understand

Chiplet technologies,they need to do their homeworkand this is what another thingwe talk about with Gordon Moore's rules.

We're about to blow the doorswide open on what you think you knowa CPU can doright between the Chiplet technologyand Chipletsis the ability to put other chipswith a CPU next to a CPUbasically on the same framework.

So we can do a whole bunchof very interesting things.

But on silicon, let's be clear onthis is on spot on silicon,not on the motherboard.

Other more like. Physical.

Silicon silicon like you can stackand package right there on the silicon.

But then on top of thatyou think about what CSL is going to doto the entire motherboard, right?

And all of the devices and things,you think about what we're goingto be able to do because of that,because of the chip,what's because of CSL,what we're going to be ableto do with edge devices right.

Well, I mean look at it,

You're seeing the picture of likethere's a great photo of like a RadioShackad from 1980, 85 and it's got the campfour and it's got, you know, the,the CD player and all that stuff.


And then in front of it'sgot a picture of a smartphoneand it's like, Oh, yeah,but all of that now fits in here, right?

I will tell you that

I am really excited about CSL.

I'm very excited about Chipletsand all of itbecause I know that that is going to bethe next evolution in industry.

So this is not the time to take a nap.

If you work in I.T.and technology,this is the time to start getting smartbecause we are about to do a cheetahflip in the driveway, no differentthan when we first introduced USB.

When we first introduced wi fi technology,some people said couldn't be done.

It couldn't be done today.

Let me tell you, there's nothingwe don't do on Wi-Fi, right?

A teenager,the first thing they're looking forwhen they get to grandma's house iswhat's the lifetime password?

What's a wife? Hey,

I know Grandma wrote it on the road.

And, you know,

I should probably put it on the fridge.

And if she's like me, I put a littlenightstand literally on our guest stand.

Now in our guest room, we literally havea little flag that says Nice, nice.

Here's a lifetime password, right? Yeah.

My my son did that when I visited here.

It was. It was great.

I didn't have to ask him for it.

And I saw it in a friend's housewith copied it.

And I will tell you thatthat is now the new normal.

And because of that cell edgedevice, Chiplets,you're about to see comprehensive

AI at the edge.

You're about to see comprehensive cloudedge architecturesthat are like nothing you've ever seen.

So think about how fast we went from cableanalog to, you know, dial up,you know, telephone modems to to catfive to fiber to Wi-Fi.

It wasn't 50 years.

It wasn't 90 years.

It was like 12 and a half years.

We weren't going to want to do another doanother.

In fact, I have I have 5G to the housefor my WiFi and cable.

Right to the house, because I have both.

Right? Why?

Because I have too many devicesand too many kids.

That's the problem. Right.

And right and well,and then also you think about

StarLink and the satellite constellations.

We're now about to open the Internet,the entire rest of the worldbelow the Southern hemisphere.

These folks have never had the Internet.

I was talking with some of our leadershipteam about I'm like, hey,you guys might want to start writingstuff downbecause I don't think you understand.

A third of the planet is aboutto get Internet for the first time.

Like true, the internet, you know,the speeds you appreciate every day.

They are about to find out.

And I will tell you, there was a hugeeducational evolution about

I was reading a paper about,

I think how kids learnin a technological environment.

Some kids are visual learners.

Some kids who book learners like to read,some want to see pictures.

Someone to see them off doesn't matter.

The point is, is that computeroperated algorithm based computer trainingcan now identify which way do they learn

Ratio programs answers they don't know.

And you've all done it.

You've all taken your corporate testsand they ask you the same questionsover and over again because they want youto know the information.

They don't want you to get a wrong answer,just call it because that doesn'thelp you to get to the next plateauof educational development.

They need you to know the data.

And so we're startingto see evolution of technologies.

And I'm really actually interested to seewhere educationis going to go on that front.

And talking about competition,you know,who's getting the best test scores becausethe kids are getting the best educationand then what's going towhat are they going to inventbecause of the things they can now do?

Agree the pyramid.

I think we're actuallylooking at Gordon's more

I think Moore's Lawis going to be outdated.

Honestly, I don't think it'sgoing to be accurate anymore.

I think it's going to gothe other direction. I think we're.

Going to go faster.

It's potentially could gosignificantly fasterbased on all of the things we know to betrue.

Also, people are living longer.

That information is being passedfrom generation to generation more.

And just that alonewill significantly enhance capabilitybecause people are working longer.

And then, you know, you learnfrom experience leaders, the longeraround, the more they know and the morethey know, the more they can teach.

So this is great. Yeah.

Jason, it's always a pleasure.

I always have fun talking to you.

So I thank you for coming on the show.

I appreciate that.

I do.

Every time we talk,you say something I never.

Oh, well, I say stuffall the time that no one understands.

So I just want to know,when am I getting my hoverboard?

That's what I want.


We've got.

All the waythat. We've got all these people.

But I want to know,when am I going to get my husband right?

Yeah, I can write it,but I want to see it in action.

I want a transporter too,

Just so you know.

I would.

Just say. In-Flight thing would be nice.

I'm kind of scared of the dynamicsof how that would work out,but I like the way you're goingvery seriously and honestly.

And one more thing.

I know thatwe're going to get cut off, but, you know,when we start talking about angstromsand the new fabs that are going in Ohio,

I never in my life envisionedthat we would get to angstrom development.


And we're watching it in real timeright now as I'm watching concrete trucks.

And if you've ever seen the timelapse videos of them portraying the Fab

Four, that facility,it's just amazing to see, you know,

Angstroms in motion, I guess, would bethe best way I could describe it.

Yeah, it truly is amazing.

And and that's just two years.

Out right now.

We're not talking about 2030 when peopleare like, oh, I take five, ten years.

I think it'll be done in two.

Yeah, I can't even imagine 20, 30what it's going to look like.

Yeah, it's yeah.

Crazy times.

Jason, again,thanks for coming on the show.

Thanks, Darren Always a pleasure.

Thank you for listeningto Embracing Digital Transformation today.

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